Tuesday, July 31, 2007

Vegie pie wins supreme award

As a vegetarian I just want to say hah! It's great to see that the winner of this year's best pie is a vegetarian pie...you can read more here


Anonymous Anonymous said...

Woh. What a 'flurry' of posts...

11:13 pm  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The smoke is so thick that I can't even spy the land...

11:16 pm  
Blogger Richard Taylor said...

A "vegetarian pie" is an oxymoron.

Everyone should eat lots of red meat - it is vastly good for one's health.

None of these willy woofter meatlessnessness and Greeny weaknesses for me!!

I used to eat my lunch in the slaughter house at Hellabies in 1968 etc My father designed the slaughter house there (for processing beef), and a lot else, including the conveyer belt systems etc.

He was tough little Pom who accidentally killed a man in a boxing bout in Britain - it caused big problems - (the man who copped it was the British Amateur Champion. (lightweight).

So he didn't worry about killing animals - if it was necessary.

But he didn't like cruelty to animals and nor do I.

I used to love the steak and kidney pies made by Georgie pie.

2:27 am  
Blogger Skyler said...

A pie is just pastry with a filling! And so a vegetarian pie isn't an oxymoron but I can understand that for traditional kiwis it could be an afront for a vegie pie to win.
It's good to try new things though and move forward - there is definitely room for more variety.Vegie pies taste better!!
Haven't you heard that the trad pies, the good old mince 'n' cheese, are bad for you!?

10:03 am  
Blogger Sanctuary said...

This is the sort of thing that happens when the feminazis of helengrad repealed section 59.

1:43 pm  
Anonymous Mike B said...

I am also a vegie pie connoisseur... My best experience with NZ vegie pies are from 1. the bakery at the corner of Great North Rd and Premier Ave in Point Chev. (Not sure what it's called but I used to live above the bakery and we called it the 'Ta Bakery' on account of what the woman who owned it would say very enthusiastically when you bought something.)
2. Mays' Pies in Timaru. I should declare that Mays' is owned by my extended family, but still, it's a good vege pie.

4:31 pm  
Blogger Richard Taylor said...

Pies are very dangerous things. Hamish Dewe once said -

"Don't fall off this bridge [the Sydney Harbour bridge], it could be very dangerous."

People should also think very carefully before or about eating pies.

Maps has the right idea - I must join him to tuck into huge a hamburger.

MacDonald's is crap - Wendy's is a bit better and Burger King is marginal - Kentucky is death...very fatty stuff.

But while I allow them the right to exist - I am very dubious of these Veggie People - but I love me veggies - but also me meat (and fish and chicken).

I refuse to hear any criticism of egg burgers either.

7:26 pm  
Blogger Sanctuary said...

Is it me, or generally do Asian bakeries triumph at the pies and other such hot goods, but generally tend to struggle with the subtle Anglo-Scots tradition of baking decent cakes?

And does anyone know where one can still purchase (in Auckland) a good example of that true test of the baker's art, a Lamington like the ones I had as a kid?

9:43 pm  
Blogger Skyler said...

The winners of the vege pie category are as follows:
Gold: (carrots, silver beet, broccoli, red capsicum, cauliflower in a creamy white sauce) Neville Jackson, Jackson's Bakery & Cafe, Havelock North.

Silver: (pea and carrot, potato, corn, courgette, with capsicum and spinach) Sa Thi Chau, Elite Cake Shop, Lower Hutt.

Bronze: (mushroom, potatoes, carrots an broccoli, green and red peppers, cauliflower, courgette in a creamy white sauce) Bill Lenh Liem, Greenland Bakery & Cafe, Botany,Auckland.

It seems the judges like pies in white sauces! There is an organic shop on Pt Chev Rd that sells vege pies, also harvest wholefoods and mamata bakery - all sell great tastey vege pies :-)

I agree with you about your choice of fast food chains Richard. Don't hate the veges! I'm just making a choice not to eat meat for health, taste and ethical grounds :-) There's no need for us to eat so much meat these days and if you do eat it you should make a moral choice to eat free range and locally butchered.Slaughter houses are aweful places and the transportation of livestock is cruel.

5:05 pm  
Blogger Richard Taylor said...

No! Skyler - I love slaughterhouses - they are lyrical places! Read Rimbaud...

Meat is a wonderful food - you are under a misconception - meat is vital for good health - it is the best food. It is grass marvelously transformed for the human predator's use - all primates and Man eat meat - Chimpanzies and other monkeys also eat meat. I actually think that vegtarianism is immmoral; as we need our children to get all the benefits of meat and great nutrition - e.g. proteins - and all the amino acids (difficult to get them all from nuts etc - and some in meat are essential to growth in the teenage years) - all the B vitamins - you are merely being soft and sentimental - humans have eaten meat whenever they have been able to get it for thousands and thousands of years - all beings on this earth eat other beings - that is life.

When I die I will be eaten - I am being eaten right now as you are -as we all are (consuming and consumed) - but the phagocytes are eating these viri and bacteria that eat our meat (when we get old and so on we will all eventually lose this constant battle - Nature always wins) - your vegetarian position is weak science and sentimentalism. It is also in my view morally wrong NOT to eat meat. Cows etc were bred to be butchered or milked. We are just intelligent tigers - we would act like the beautiful lion if we had to.

I would eat anything if I had to (and I love animals) - I watched a film about Eskimoes by Eskimoes (who respected the animals they killed) and they were eating raw reindeer meat - it is best raw! But of course they also cooked meat and eggs. Some African tribes still drink blood - blood is very very valuable as a food - it includes iron and many proteins and vitamins.

Our economy was dependent upon meat - we weakened ourselves by not building large and strong primary industries. Too many meat works shut down hence our now over dependence on the US and imports and $2 crap from China ...I also love vegetables. But meat is just a vegetable or vegetables transformed.

By meat I include fish and poultry also. You have to remember that that fluffy cuddly lovely cat you see that you don't want to kill -would NOT hesitate to kill you if it had to to survive. It is a predator and so is Man.

And Man will stay one even if we destroy ourselves (which is very likely but doesn't concern me at all - we may indeed be fundamentally flawed)) - better that than the weakness of veganism etc

Better the bang than the whimper.. better the Gotterdammerung and the fire! Eat meat!

10:23 pm  
Blogger Skyler said...

I'll reply more fully later Richard (as I'm at work at the moment) but I think we've had the debate on vegetarianism before.
Why do you equate strength with eating meat/drinking blood etc? Harking back to the hunter gatherer man - nothing to do with empathy, compassion, intellect etc?...
I'd kill to survive too (i.e. fish or butcher an animal) but I don't need to kill to survive.

Meat isn't the "best" food it's quite hard for our bodies to digest and get the nutrients out of - I’ll write more on this later.

Check out the UK vegetarian society website: http://www.vegsoc.org/info/index.html

5:25 pm  
Blogger Richard Taylor said...

Look at wolves and cats - lions tigers and jaguars - they are strong, beautiful, merciless, courageous, and powerful!

It is harder for the human body to digest vegetable matter (most is poisonous for us);children don't like vegetables because in fact humans instinctively are wary of "strange" or tastes hat are not very sweet or savoury as such so in fact children don't require as much vegetable matter as adults; (and in the early stages of life people are establishing taste patterns and in some cases seeing what they might be allergic to etc) this has been proven - also the immense value of meat is a scientific fact - cows etc have two stomachs and bacteria to assist them with that - we are naturally adapted to eat meat - we need meat.

8:21 pm  
Blogger Skyler said...

A typical vegetarian diet closely matches expert dietary recommendations for healthy eating, being low in saturated fat and high in fibre, complex carbohydrates, and fresh fruit and vegetables.

Many people worry that when they stop eating meat and fish, they might be in danger of some nutritional deficiency. This is not the case as all the nutrients you need can easily be obtained from a vegetarian diet. In fact research shows that in many ways a vegetarian diet is healthier than that of a typical meat-eater.

Meat supplies protein, fat, some B vitamins and minerals (mostly iron, zinc, potassium and phosphorous). Fish, in addition to the above, supplies vitamins A, D, and E, and the mineral iodine. All these nutrients can be easily obtained by vegetarians from other sources - http://www.vegsoc.org/info/basic-nutrition.html

Good sources of iron for vegetarians include wholegrain cereals and flours, leafy green vegetables, blackstrap molasses, pulses such as lentils and kidney beans, and some dried fruits.

B12 can be found in dairy products and eggs.

Study: vegan diets healthier for planet, people than meat diets: http://www-news.uchicago.edu/releases/06/060413.diet.shtml

Teen Vegetarians Healthier Than Meat-Eaters -Study: http://www.commondreams.org/headlines02/0512-03.htm

9:29 am  
Blogger Skyler said...

Isn't part of being human that we can express mercy and use our intellect not just base animal behaviour? Why to you idealise the wildness of animals Richard? (not that I have anything against animals!).

Much of the meat (and dairy) these days is pumped full of unatural hormones etc http://www.goveg.com/contamination_hormones.asp

Vegetarians don’t eat fish and they never have!

Impacts of Biodiversity Loss on Ocean Ecosystem Services: http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/short/314/5800/787

Some yummy vegetarian recipes:

Follow link above for dishes such as:
Thai Style Cauliflower and Carrot Terrine
with Chilli and Peanut Dressing

Creamy Watercress and Blue Cheese Pasta
with Grilled Fennel

Broccoli, Grilled Halloumi and Cherry Tomato Salad

Aubergine, Potato and Chick Pea Balti

10:08 am  
Blogger Richard Taylor said...

Skyler - I am a meat eater and always will be and I know that meat is an excellent (and indeed an essential) food - BUT - I will agree on this - in a good diet it is very useful to eat non meat products (plenty of vegetables - I love brussell sprouts and so on)(also fruit and cereals - I know as i sue them every day) (I know that Vegans - from Indians sometimes don't even eat eggs - I met a Welsh man some years ago who was married to an Indian woman and his in laws were strict Vegans - and they totally freaked when he boiled some eggs and they exploded in them in a microwave - he forgot about them) - the Vegan Indians and the Japs in the old days who got less meat were not very big...the average size (and the general good health) of the has Japanese etc has increased since say the 1920s - and particularly since WW2.

But while I dismiss all arguments against meat - some foods such as nuts etc and so on are neglected by people who go too far the other way - they eat food such as hamburgers from MacDonalds and soft drinks, too many biscuits etc etc and so on and this contributing to the obesity and poor health of many people throughout the world. But it is essential to eat meat especially for growing children. Anyone not eating meat is in danger of suffering from low B levels (especially B12 - the effects of which can be accumulative and dangerous). There are other biochemical health negatives. Fish and chicken are excellent foods.

But there are many foods that replace sugar or carbohydrate heavy products -such as various nuts that are an excellent food (e/.g slower release of fructose rather the sudden surges if one goes heavy on sugary stuff) - but remember that both chimpanzees and baboons have been known to eat meat (since at least the mid 70s) (I studied chemistry and biology at school in which subject I was dux and I also read books on Anthropology - and indeed a paper I have for my BA is Human Anthro as well as one in Mathematics oddly enough - but most of it was literature)).

The most advanced and beautiful animals are meat eaters. The Siberian Tiger is the largest Tiger in the world and is very beautiful.

The Chinese killing of the tigers for (not real) aphrodisiacs - that is nonsense - they are primitive in thinking it has any such value - also elephants - is criminal.

But I urge people to keep eating meat.

11:53 pm  
Blogger Skyler said...

oh well, let's agree to disagree Richard but as I said before you can get iron and B12 from non meat sources and that seems to be your only arguement against being vegetarian.

Haven't the Japanese got one of the best healths in the world? I think b/c of the amount of fresh veges and fish they eat and the low red meat intake?

10:57 am  
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7:21 pm  
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2:55 am  

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